Introduction to Print Oral History of Ramon S. Francisco November 30, 2002 By Nikki Laņas and Tara Perez Perez. We are Tara Perez and Nikki Laņas and we're doing this interview for our oral history project. Francisco. Okay, shoot. P: For the record, please state your name. F: Okay my name is Ramon S. Francisco. P: What is your [current] job position? F: Okay, my title is associate editor of the Manila Bulletin and editor of the Animal Scene Magazine. P: Please describe the nature of your work. F: Okay, as associate editor, I try to coordinate the news stories being fed into the computers by our reporters. I also coordinate with the photographers on their photo coverage ... Ordinarily... I lay out some of the inside pages and do some editing for the newspaper. In editing, I check and double-check the sentences of the photographers and the reporters. In the Animal Scene Magazine, I do [almost] the same thing by editing the articles given to us by our writers. P: Okay, thank you. Aside from being a journalist, what are the other jobs that you have? F: I [am] also an assistant professor at the University of Santo Tomas. I teach Political Journalism, Editing, and Copy Reading this semester. P: When did you start [teaching]? F: I started teaching in 1967. That's about 33 or 34 years [of] teaching. P: Do these conflict with your being a journalist? F: No, in fact, they supplement each other. I teach in the morning and I'm here in the afternoon. I find this a perfect formula. P: Why Sir? Can you [expound on that]? F: I teach the young, they learn from me, and I also learn from them. I believe [that] education's a two-way process. It's not a one-way ticket. P: Can you please give us a little background about yourself? ... Do you have any relatives who also belong in the field? F: I think I'm the only one in the business. And I think they're happy that I'm the only one in this [industry]. P: Why is that so? F: Because they find it very, very taxing. But [for] me, it's [just] part of the ordinary life. P: From what school did you graduate? F: I graduated in 1967 from the University of Santo Tomas, Faculty of Philosophy and Letters, Major in Journalism, Minor in Public Relations. P: [Did you receive] any special awards or recognition that you during your [college years]? F: In 1967? Yes, I received an award. After 4 years of honest cheating, I graduated Suma cum laude. P: Was being a journalist your greatest ambition in your life? F: At first, after graduation from high school, I was thinking of being a disc jockey [in] a radio station. I did some time in a radio station somewhere [along] Taft Avenue. It was called at that time DZMB and our battle cry was "The station of top hits" at that time. Then later on, I decided to go into print media and studied four years of [Journalism]. P: How were you able to get into the print media business. F: Well, one week before graduation day, I decided to ask my friend in an afternoon paper called The Evening News if they [had] a vacancy in that paper. Fortunately, there was one slot. So I hastily ran to the newspaper office in Port Area, Intramuros, Manila [which is] just five minutes from here and after an interview, I got the job. P: Were you part of [the school organ]? F: The school newspaper? P: Yes. F: Yes, I was the editor-in-chief of "The Flame." P: Flame? F: The newspaper organ of my small college. P: Sir, who was the one responsible for getting you into the business? Is it just you? Or did somebody [assist you]? F: ... In The Evening News, my good friend, I think he's now in the States, helped me land [on] that [publication] as a desk editor... Unfortunately, [the paper] died a natural death. It's no longer around. P: What's the name of [the paper]? F: The paper was called Evening News. At that time, it was owned by the Elizalde Family which [also] owned several radio stations and the defunct TV channel 11. P: Has entering the business been easy or difficult for you? What were the challenges you had to face? F: Well, [for] me, [the business is] my cup of tea and [entering] it was just like eating pie or pizza because I was trained to do newspaper work. Challenges... Everyday is a challenge because you come across different problems and different kinds of people or characters and this makes my life very interesting and colorful. P: Okay, were you ever a cub reporter? R: Yes. I was a cub reporter and my assignment... Let me check, let me recall... My assignment was to cover the customs and tourism more or less [from] 1967 'til 1969. I [also did] features and news analysis. P: What was it like? How were you treated by people in your publication as a cub reporter? F: Well, they treated me well. I found talking to people very interesting because I [got to] know their problems. They [told] me their problems, and I [offered] them solutions. P: Can you share some of the most unforgettable experiences? F: During my reportorial work? P: Yes. F: I remember having covered customs and one of my most interesting stories was [about] a gun battle between customs security men and Manila policemen. They were fighting about smuggled goods. P: Where was this? F: This was at pier 15 at the Manila South Harbor. I was covering [then] customs commissioner Rolando Geotina [during that time when] a shootout or a gun battle [took place] between the two forces. Fortunately, I ran faster than the bullets. Several police enforcers were killed, others were wounded, but I found myself still in one piece to write the story. Laņas. So how about the other experiences like [the] embarrassing or difficult or degrading ones? F: Embarrassing... None really but for the most memorable parts of my reportorial life, I remember having covered ... Pope Paul VI when he was here. You were not yet around [then], I'm very sure, when Pope Paul VI arrived in the Philippines. He was the first pope to visit this country. I covered his arrival at the old Manila International Airport and witnessed the [murder] attempt on his life ... I also covered his speeches in different places in Metro Manila until the last day when [he] greeted all the reporters who covered him and gave us several rosaries and some other mementos which I still keep at home. L: So how have these experiences affected your personality and work style? F: Well I think these experiences toughened me and made my life more interesting. Another interesting coverage was when I was assigned to cover a plane crash. I was rather shocked to see the mangled bodies of plane crash victims. I even went up the hills of Antipolo in Rizal to reach the crash site with the other reporters. Very, very interesting indeed. And then there was when I wrote about the ... first born 747 jumbo jet. I was invited by Air France to cover the inaugural flight of Paris to New York. I was nervous at that time because it was my first time aboard a plane and I was alone. [I was] supposed to be with [another reporter] but the other guy chickened out so [I flew] alone several miles over the Atlantic Ocean from Paris to New York When I reached to New York, I began singing to myself "New York, New York." See? Very interesting, indeed. But I'm very sure that when you go professional, you'll experience more interesting things than these. I also covered the late President Marcos when he traveled from Manila all the way to London in Europe and then down to Kenya, in South Eastern Africa. I [also] covered the International Monetary Fund and World Bank Conference. This was my biggest conference coverage. I interviewed hundreds of bankers, investors and financiers and they were all asking about the character of President Marcos. L: So when did you become a professional journalist? In what year and at what age? F: I became a professional journalist more or less in 1967 when I was about 18 or 19 years old. I was then sporting the fad of that time - a crew cut ala Elvis Presley. L: Can you please describe to us the situation of the country during that time? What were the famous events, people, trends, economic situation? F: During that time, money was very, very, very much around, the prices were rather low, life was relatively easy, and you can get by with about P10 or P20 a day during the good old days. The people ... respected one another, there was less graft and corruption, the government controlled, maintained peace and order - everything was doing fine. That was the age of the 70's and 60's which I think you will find in the forthcoming Metro Manila [Film Festival] movie "Dekada 70." If you see that movie, then [you'll know] the temperament of the times. L: Where was your publication located then? F: Okay, the [for the] first one, The Evening News, our offices were located in Port Area Intramuros, Manila. The second one, the old Manila Times, was [along] Florentino Torres St., Sta. Cruz, Manila ... The Evening Post, was right here along Bonifacio Drive, Intramuros Manila - just a stone's throw away from the Department of Public Works and Highways building. L: Can you please describe its physical location? F: Which one? L: Each publication. F: Each publication. Okay, the old Evening News was located in an old building just near the [present] traffic department of the Western Police District. I think this old building is now ... an electrical appliance store. The next building, the old Manila Times, is now ... a department store. Usually when I pass by [that building] in the evening, my eyes become teary [because] I remember those days when I would climb up the stairs of the old Manila Times going to the editorial newsroom. The next was the Evening Post, and [its] building is now occupied by several offices and I think a medical clinic [along] Bonifacio Drive, Intramuros, Manila. L: What was the condition of the buildings? F: The conditions of the [buildings] at that time... Well they were rather sturdy. They were easily accessible to transportation and [they] survived several earthquakes. L: Can you please describe the office set-up. The typical office set-up. How were the departments arranged? F: [For] our missions at that time, we used old crummy but very durable and reliable typewriters and for long distance stories, our reporters dictated their stories to us [through the] telephone. [If not], we had ... telegrams or telex stories from places outside Metro Manila and even from abroad. There were no computers at that time and long distance ... was not exactly reliable. L: What were the typical office scenes? What were the normal activities of the people? F: The people at that time including myself went discoing and went from one restaurant to another. But the restaurants were just a handful. There was no Jollibee, no McDonald's. We settled for local delicacies like puto, bibingka, puto bumbong, and even ... potato chips, banana cues, and kamote cues. But Coca Cola was [already] there and it was our [favorite] beverage. I don't go for coffeee and tea. L: Going back to the office part. Did the offices have all the necessities that you needed for work like telecommunications devices and printing devices? F: Okay. During the good, old days, we only [had] typewriters. Tape recorders were hard to come by because they were rather expensive so we relied on our notebooks and ball pens and the good, old telephones. [There were] no cell phones at that time. L: So what were the telecommunications devices that you used then? F: At that time? L: Aside from the telephone. F: Well, I remember the good, old telex and the telegraphs. Like I remember correctly, there [were] PT&T and RCPI. L: So when did you start working with computers? F: With the? L: With the computers. F: With the computers? Let me check... It was about 1987 or 88. ... When the computers came in, we were trained here on the Bulletin building's third floor. We were taught how to use the first system... I [already forgot] the name of that system, [but] we found it very, very handy. [Right] now, we're using the Microsoft Word system. L: What were the programs that you used when you first used the computers? F: The first programs... I [already forgot] the names of the [programs] but [during] that time, as long as they worked, [they were] fine with us. But [they had] some technical lapses and so we [also] had to wait until the technicians [repaired them]... L: About the telecommunication devices, would you say that they are comparable to the latest in modern technology? F: Well during our time, they were rather "Jurassic" compared to the ones we [have] now because of the element of speed. Because of these computers, we [now] have an advantage of speed over the devices we used during the 80's and 60's. L: So by how much did modern technology improve [your work]? F: The modern technology, the computers, stepped up our work by about 100 or 101%, I would say. Oh, before I forget, aside from those good, old Jurassic communications, we [also] had our memories in the palms of our hands [which we used for writing] some notes. [When] we didn't have pieces of paper around, we just memorized the facts or even [got] some tissue paper from a restaurant nearby [for taking down] notes. L: So you were really good in memorization during that time. F: Well, we were trained to [be good at] that. [But] remember, we [only] used our memories as a last resort. A good reporter must always carry a ball pen or several ball pens and several pieces of paper [for taking down] notes. Just like in school. L: What can you say about your offices' lighting and ventilation during those times? F: During the good, old days...Yeah, we had air-con but sometimes they did not work so we relied on the good, old, reliable electric fans ... We [also] had fans made out of cardboards and thick pieces of paper. L: So did these shortcomings affect your work performance? F: No, these shortcomings did not affect our work because ... the show had to go on. So despite the heat, ... the frequent electricity brownouts, we worked on and on until we finished our work. After submitting our stories to our editors, we [would go] off to downtown Quiapo [or to Makati] to relax. But, as I told you earlier, there were only a few restaurants because during those days, we had the vendo machines. [By just] using coins and pressing some buttons, we had instant chicken sandwich, instant cheese sandwich, and cups of Coke with ice cubes. Our girlfriends understood our problems so they [adjusted] to our problems. L: Can you please describe the people you've worked with? F: Well, I've worked with all kinds of interesting people. I find them friendly and they [have] become my friends. L: What can you say about your publisher? F: About? L: Your past publishers. F: About our past publishers? Yeah, they were very, very, friendly and accommodating and they were very, very understanding of our problems and shortcomings. L: What about your editors? F: Our editors were very, very strict at that time. We shudder whenever they [shouted] at us because we [thought of them as] lords and masters. L: How about your other colleagues? F: Our other colleagues, our other reporters and editors? Yeah, they were also our friends. We shared problems but not girlfriends. L: So is your relationship with them "strictly business?" F: Strictly business... Yes. But I [also] consider them my friends. L: So what do you usually do when you're not working? F: When we were not working... You mean [at present]? L: During the past. F: During the good, old days? During those days, when we were not working, we were gallivanting, playing around, going to discos, ... and eating. [During] that time, I was addicted to pinball machines. L: [Just like the] present arcades. F: No billiards for me. No beer, no cigarettes. P: Was there a time that when [you had to do a report] during your off-work hours ... ? F: Oh, yes! We had instant stories. In [such cases], we had to attend to our work and say goodbye to our girlfriends because work had to come first before pleasure. L: So how do you get to the location where you're supposed to cover this certain event? F: Well, we used the jeepneys if not some of the service vehicles of our newspapers ... But if [the locations] were nearby, we just [walked]. L: Can you mention some memorable editors that you've had in the past? F: ... I remember the late Jose Luna Castro of the old Manila Times, ... Prudencio Europa, my first editor-in-chief, Mr. Noli Hara, my first city editor, Mr. Icban, who's still around ... He is still our ... news editor. He was my editor in the old Manila Times. The others are still around, the others [have] already passed away. L: What makes them memorable for you? F: They taught me the ropes. What you learn in school is entirely different from what you learn in actual practice of the profession. L: Okay, so how were they when it came to accuracy? F: As far as accuracy was concerned, they wanted us to be as accurate as [N.A.S.A. in Houston, Texas]. L: Okay, what about in Ethics? F: ... We were taught Press Ethics in school and ... our teachers at that time told us to be very, very honest and to uphold our integrity. [This is also what] I've been telling our reporters and my students. [I told them] not to succumb to graft and corruption and to stick to integrity and preserve ... their reputations [as well as their families' and schools' reputation]. L: What about the grammar aspects of writing? Were they strict on grammar usage? Syntax? F: Yes. Editors should be strict in grammar especially [in] spelling, [usage of] punctuation [marks], capitalization, especially the [subject-verb agreements]. L: So how did they communicate with you in terms of correcting your mistakes or citing your shortcomings? F: Well, during that time, I called the reporters to my side and pointed to them the errors so that they won't repeat those errors. They thank me for it because they say that they're learning more inside the newsroom than in school ... What you learn in school will consist most of theories. Once you're out of school, whether you're a graduate or not, you'll learn more about the realities of life. L: What about you, Sir, what did you learn from your, um, previous editors? F: Okay, from my previous editors, I learned the value of hard work. They taught me to be very, very frank and sincere with my work, to be loyal to the company, and to see to it that our reporters also [learn] from us since [our work] is always a two-way process: [we] give and take... L: So are you impressed by the kind of discipline that they used on you? F: Yes. Discipline is very important in life because without discipline, your life will go into tatters ... [and] you will have no peace and order in your [professional and personal] life. L: What was their attitude towards deadlines? F: As far as headlines are concerned, the headlines should be very, very accurate. There is no room for sensationalism. The headlines ... should be very, very frank and ... straightforward. There is no room for sensationalism or what we call "Yellow Journalism." L: Sir, what about the "dead" lines? F: Deadlines? Here in the Bulletin, our deadline is generally 5:30-6:00 p.m. [If they don't make it on time], the reporters must explain to us why they failed to beat the deadline. If we feel that their stories are very important, we still make some adjustments to accommodate them in the paper. Otherwise, we tell them to just write the story and store them in the computers and go home. They ... suffer consequences such as [fines or suspensions. If not], we don't use their stories for a certain period of time to teach them a lesson [on being] punctual which is, of course, part of reportorial discipline. P: Sir, were you ever not able to comply with the deadline? F: When I was a reporter? P: Yes. F: Yes, many times. And I was penalized. I think [during] that time, the penalty was in fines. If I remember right, I was fined about P50 [for failing] to beat the deadline. But that taught me a dozen and it became part of my professional discipline. [In order to beat the deadline, I] adjust my watch or advance it by about ... thirty minutes to an hour before the actual time ... This was when I was a ... fledgling reporter. P: Who was your editor that time? F: At that time, my editor-in-chief ... was Mr. Prudencio Europa. He's very much around. L: So what other techniques did you use in doing your work fast and correctly? F: Well it's a matter of discipline and [thinking] hard [of] what to write about. When you're on the way to the office, your mind must not always be [set on] your girlfriend or girlfriends. You should always [think] about your work and what you are going to write about [so that] when you reach the newspaper office, you can drumbeat and face your typewriter or computer and start working right away ... You should already have a mental framework of what you're going to do instead of, you know, just thinking of something else, of eating, or smoking, or drinking beer or Cali, or whatever. You should already have a skeleton or an outline of your work before even stepping [on] the first marble slab of your newspaper office. L: Can you name some of the most memorable colleagues that you've worked with? F: Most memorable? L: Colleagues. F: Colleagues. Okay. Well, a good number of them were American writers ... We shared notes and from them, I learned how to write faster and better ... We discussed common problems about writing our stories and trying to beat [deadlines]. L: Who were the more popular ones? F: Well, let me check... Some of them have passed away. Some of them are still around like Mr. Rod Reyes, who's now [assigned] abroad, I think in Taiwan. And I remember [another] American, who at that time was with the Associated Press ... He is now with the New York Times and [from] time to time, we communicate [with] each other and exchange views [about] our problems and our [lives] in the newsroom. My other colleagues are working for other newspapers. P: Can we have [their] names ... ? F: The other guys in the other newspapers? Okay, one good example is Mr. Ricky Lo, the Entertainment editor of Star, ... Mr. Tony Katigbak, [who] is also with the Philippine Star, Mr. Lito Zulueta, who is with the Inquirer, ... Ms. Julie Yap-Daza who ... was my teacher in Public Relations in school. She's now the editor of the Manila Standard ... Another colleague of mine is Mr. Lito Tacohan, Sports editor of the Philippine Star. The others are working for some TV stations like Mr. Arnold Clavio of GMA 7, and ... Ms. Karen Lim of ABC TV Channel 5, and some other guys and gals whose names I've forgotten. Whenever I bump into them, we share some laughs and ... go to the nearest restaurant [or pizza stand] to drown our sorrows in hamburger and Coke. L: Can you mention some significant events that you've covered locally and abroad? F: Okay, I've covered, as I said earlier, the arrival of Pope Paul VI at that time, ... Pope John Paul II in his first visit to this country, ... plane crashes, ... [and] several actors and actresses when they were here for several film festivals. [I interviewed] Donald Sutherland when he was here promoting a movie [and] another a guy whom you love to hate ... Claus Skinsky, the German character actor. I interviewed him by the swimming pool of the Manila Hotel several years ago. Claus Skinsky. And then for the actresses, I remember having interviewed Jane Fonda when she was here promoting a movie and some other local movie stars whose names we should all rather forget because they often showed their bodies onscreen. In other words, many of them were "bomba stars." L: Which particular event was the biggest and most controversial? F: Most controversial... If I remember right, it was the Dovey Beams scandal. P: Can you expound [on] that? F: Dovey Beams. Dovey Beams was an American movie star who was romantically linked to a top government official. When we interviewed her, she tried to prove that she and that government official were lovers. It turned out later that it was all a hoax. L: Who was this government official? F: I guess I better not mention his name because he's already [resting] in peace. L: Which event was the most recent one? The most recent coverage. F: The most recent event ... was when I interviewed successful Filipinos abroad when I was sent abroad on a travel grant. This was in 1996. I interviewed several successful Filipinos abroad whom we now call the OCW's, the Overseas Contract Workers. They told me that they've learned to love their adopted countries and they would rather not ... [come] back to this country because of problems of poverty and unemployment. In other words, they think that they are now happier abroad rather than [here in the] Philippines. P: Do you remember your first beat? F: Yeah, my first beat was customs and followed by tourism. P: ... Did you learn anything important when you first covered your first beat? F: Well, when I covered my first beat, customs, I learned how to run very fast because of, as I said earlier, the gun battle story which I wrote about. For the good things in the coverage, I learned how to adjust to different sorts of people behind their trade at the customs. Some of them were smugglers, some of them ... were "bandidos." But I learned to adjust to their life and they learned to respect me in my work. P: Who else was covering the same beat? Who were the other people? F: The other people were from other newspapers. If I remember right, they [were from] the defunct Manila Chronicle, the Philippines Herald, and some other tabloids at that time. Oh, and I still remember another interesting story. It was a story when I interviewed the then Vice President Fernando Lopez. At that time, I represented the old Manila Times. My companion ... was a good, [short] reporter. His name was Larry Zaballa of the old Manila Bulletin. He and I went up ... the S.S. President Wilson. Now, this story is very interesting because Fernando Lopez was very, very mad because the two of us were the only reporters who interviewed him and there was no reporter from his very own Manila Chronicle. The only stories about Fernando Lopez appeared in the old Manila Times and the old Manila Bulletin and there was nothing in the Vice President's very own [publication]. I was told that some [eyes] rolled in that newspaper because someone failed to send a reporter to cover [its] owner ... Vice President Fernando Lopez. L: Did you cover historical events like EDSA Revolution or coup d' etat? F: That time, I was already inside the newsroom ... I did not actually cover them but I edited them. L: What was the worst thing that happened to you while you were in the line of duty? F: If you're speaking of danger ... I received several death threats but I ignored them and just prayed. Another danger I faced was ... a [Libel suit]. [Fortunately], probably somebody up there liked me, ... this government official withdrew his case against me and our paper. L: So that was your only Libel case? F: Yes. L: How about physical injuries? F: No physical injuries. L: So how did you deal with these problems? F: Well if I were to face them [again, I would] talk to them, ... to the person who's about to threaten [me] physically, or to just run, or to go to the nearest police station. You should never, never fight back because something adverse or fatal might happen and ... you might fall hard because of that. The best thing to do is to stay away from trouble. P: Sir, what made you say that? Did something happen like that before and you fought back? Or your editors told you not to fight? F: No. From the very start, I know that the best thing to do is to stay away from harm and from trouble. But if it's inevitable, then [you'll] have to fight back using your presence skills or whatever thing you have you can use to defend your life because of the instinct of self-preservation. Or better still, run to the nearest police officer and ask for help ... It's just plain common sense. P: How were your relationships with other [people in the journalist field]? F: With other people? P: In the journalist field. F: Well, I interviewed them and because I [knew] some words and phrases in French and German, I was able to come by. I interviewed ambassadors, diplomats, and top government officials of those ... countries as part of my work. L: Sir, we're about to wrap up the interview. F: Okay. L: How long have you been a journalist? Exactly how many years? F: Well, let me do a little subtraction. Since 1967, it's about [been] about 33 or 34 years, I believe. If my arithmetic serves me right. Since 1967. L: When do you plan to retire as a journalist? F: Well I plan to retire as soon as I feel that my bones are rather weak, when my memory doesn't serve me right any longer, and when I feel I have to smell the flowers and see the green pastures of the countryside either here or abroad. That's the time [I'll] enjoy what's left of my life. L: So what do you plan to do after retiring as a journalist? F: Well, maybe, to write a book or just maybe to go abroad and eat in some restaurants in Paris, Rome, or London. Or maybe ... dance [to] jazz or the tango somewhere else. Enjoy life while I'm still alive because I believe in the dictum "Drink, dine, and be merry for tomorrow, we [shall] drink, dine, and be merry again" as [opposed to] the old saying "Drink, dine, and be merry for tomorrow, we [shall] die." L: So, are you still able to have a good time despite your cluttered schedule? F: Because of my? L: Your cluttered schedule. F: I have mastered time management. I divide my time doing this, doing that, et cetera. But, of course, I also ... think of my girlfriends. Otherwise, life will not be as rosy as it is. L: Is that all right with your wife, Sir? F: Pardon me? L: Is that all right with your wife? F: My wife has already passed away. I think she's already up there ... I would like to think that she's smiling at me. L: I'm sorry ... In general, what can you say about the time you've spent as a journalist? Was it worth it? F: I would say that my time as a journalist was very, very interesting, very colorful, and if I were to live my life again, I would exactly do the same thing. Exactly the same thing. I wouldn't wish for any other [life]. So to you, I would say enjoy life because life is too short. Enjoy life and make the most out of it. L: In addition to that, would you like to give some words of encouragement to the Com Arts students of DLSU as well as the other people who are planning to enter the field of print media? F: Okay ... to all the students of Communication Arts, Journalism, and other related fields, I would say that while you're still young, concentrate on your studies because it is the only treasure which nobody can steal from you ... Education is your biggest investment in life. Marriage cannot exactly [be considered as] an investment, I would say it's a liability. So, to you, I'd say concentrate on your studies and then after graduation, ... look for a job and be devoted to it as if it's the only thing you own in your life. L: Would you like to give a message to the people who continuously support you and the publication you're working for? F: Okay. Probably you're referring to my friends. L: To the Filipinos. F: Okay, to the people. L: Who patronize your publication. F: We should all work harder and concentrate on building good families because [if we] build good families, [we can] make the country strong and [we'll] have peace of mind. And when [we] have peace of mind, [we] can make correct and proper decisions and ... easily solve [our] problems with or without the Bureau of Internal Revenue running after [us]. L: Okay, that's all, Sir. F: Okay. L: Thank you for your time. F: I'm glad [I could help]. Okay. Ay, I forgot to tell you ... about my physical handicap. L: Okay. F: In 1996, I suffered a stroke so part of my body has some difficulties. [But despite that] I decided to go on working and to undergo some therapy so that I will not be exactly useless to myself, to my family, and to my only daughter. My only daughter is like you. She's about 24 and she's now working somewhere else as an economic analyst. Right now, I think she's somewhere in the malls enjoying life as I told her while she's still young and [doesn't have] a family of her own. Okay. P: Thank you very much, Sir. F: Okay. L: Thank you for your interesting stories. F: Okay. If you have any other question, just call me up. L: Okay thank you, Sir. F: I'm here until 8 except on [Tuesdays] when I take a bath. O, gano'n. L: Thank you, Sir. F: Sige. Anytime. Thank you.